SPEAKER_01 0:00

I'm Dan Van Orden, founder of Idea Room, and we're proud to be the official sponsors of the American Builds Father podcast. Enjoy the episode, guys. Hey guys, what's up? This is Eric. I am Edward Building Build America on you. America builds better. Hey, what's going on? This is Jared and welcome to America Builds Better. We are back with another episode. And let me tell you something right now. This is a big one. All right. This is the first episode of our Builder Show series. So you guys watched along as we did the uh previous show series. We got a lot of really positive feedback. We are going to be focusing specifically on one task over the next six weeks, and that is getting you excited for what's going on in York, Pennsylvania, June 10th and the 11th, as we join Shield Wall Media and all of the different uh vendors and sponsors and different things as we take on the York Exposition Center for the Post Frame Rural Plane Builder Show sponsored by Frame Building News. I can tell you something right now. Nothing gets me going like a Shield Wall show. All right. This is where deals get closed. This is where people are walking the show and ready to buy and ready to have good conversations. And I can tell you, whether you're a contractor, whether you're a dealer, whether you're a builder, whatever it is that you do in our industry, I can tell you you want to be in York June 10th and the 11th for the Builder Show. Big thank you up front to Idea Room. They are sponsor of the podcast. They are doing great things with 3D configurators. If you're in the market for a post frame, metal building, or shed configurator, contact the team at Idea Room. Defined SEO is here for your marketing needs. If you have any needs there, I can tell you this much. I want to hype it up as much as I can today. I'm going to share it for the first time. This is a little exciting. Let me bring it in here. I can tell you this much. Shield wall is where you want to be if you want information on the industry. Plane Builder, Rural Builder, Rollforming Magazine, Frame Building News, Metal Roofing Magazine, Roofing Elements, Garage, Shed and Carport Builder, and Metal Builder are available. And the best part is they are free. If you need a copy, contact me or contact the team at Shield Wall, and we can get you signed up for a subscription to any of the trade publications, and you can stay in the loop on everything industry related. All right. He is the man, the myth, the legend. Gary, what's going on, man? How are you? My dog decided to come and say hello.

SPEAKER_02 3:32

I'm not uh Gary isn't Gary's not the fuzzy one. This is Max.

SPEAKER_01 3:37

Well, I can tell you, let's leave right there. Yeah, yeah. Sorry. Let's lead right there. Let's lead right there. I think one of the things I want to call out at the beginning of the episode. So Max builds a pole barn. Max builds a metal roof.

SPEAKER_02 3:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:51

He's the real things in the industry. Always giving back to the community. We love that about you at Shieldwall. As Max has given us his good morning message.

SPEAKER_02 4:05

Yes, I can tell you this. It's time for him to take a walk outside because he gets to go in and out as he wants to tell me I've got to open the door for him. So we're going to take a short stroll.

SPEAKER_01 4:15

I like it.

SPEAKER_02 4:17

Yeah, he's kind of the boss.

SPEAKER_01 4:20

That's all right, man. That's all right.

SPEAKER_02 4:21

If it and if anybody ever visits our office, he goes to work with me pretty much every day.

SPEAKER_01 4:26

I love it. I love it. I can tell you this, guys. Gary is the mastermind behind Shieldwall Media. So if you're enjoying one of the publications, this is the guy you want to track down at the trade show. He's the mastermind behind the builder show. He's the mastermind behind the role forming show. We're just really thankful to be working with Gary and his team at Shieldwall because they are doing such great things in our industry and helping this industry move forward. Gary knows so much about the post frame space, it's unreal. And we want to hype the show up because we want you to be excited for it. We want to give you the layout, we want to give you all the ins and outs. We're going to talk to several people. We're going to have the team from Graeber Post. We're going to have the team from Idea Room and Smart Build. We're going to talk to Shieldwall periodically between now and then. But Gary, give us an overview about you, brother. Tell us a little bit about yourself and Shieldwall and all the things, right?

SPEAKER_02 5:22

Gosh, uh brief history for most of my life. I was actually in a different industry. Actually, about half. I'm getting older, so now it's about half my life in this. I was in the commercial fitness industry. I was an assistant strength coach at the University of Iowa. And I spent up until I was about 50 more worried about lifting heavy things than pretty much anything else. Um then through life circumstances, I ended up selling advertising in a magazine. And somehow 20 years later, I ended up owning the magazines, and I took a company that did a couple of magazines from a magazine publishing company to one that's got uh couple of trade shows, data generation, line of children's books, all kinds of things. Went from basically three magazines when it started, uh, seven magazines, two shows, data generation, children's books, and uh probably a coffee shop and some other stuff in there someplace. But yeah, no, it's it's been an adventure.

SPEAKER_01 6:26

I can tell you, man, I have enjoyed immensely getting to know you over the last couple of years. We've been working really closely as we've built out America Builds Better, and we are looking forward to the trade show. I think one of the things that's really missing in this industry from a just straightforward talking point is how we share content with one another, right? And I think one of the things that I really enjoy about when I get a copy, like I have Plane Builder right here on my desk. It's on my desk for a while. I really enjoy reading it, right? It brings me content that's relevant to what I'm doing every day. And there's so few things these days that do that for you in the kind of formatting, meaning printed magazine, anymore in this industry. I mean, do you see it differently than that?

SPEAKER_02 7:14

No, it and it it's not just printed magazines, it's everything. It goes back to one of the most uh pervasive frustrations. And that's most people that are in business, especially if it's like publishing is somewhat of a ambiguous business. It's really most people have a really hard time explaining what they do. And whenever you don't know what you do, it's really hard to make what you do be different from anything else. And the key to all of our magazines, the key to our shows is how we differentiate our two shows from each other and from other people's shows, and how we differentiate our magazines from our other magazines and from our competitors' magazines. And most people have no idea what they actually do. And if you don't know what you do, it's hard to focus on what matters and focus and ignore what doesn't.

SPEAKER_01 8:08

Yeah, yeah. So I think that's really, really good advice in this industry that we're in, it's the people that take the risks and the gambles to be ahead of the curve and learn, like myself, right? You know, I've really made it my mission here in this industry space to learn everything I can and be the best version of myself I can be. And I find that, you know, getting copies of the magazines or staying up on industry trades and and things like that tend to make me a better overall salesperson, tends to make me a better trainer for the staff underneath of me. And that's what I really enjoy about the publications. And honestly, it's how we connected. I was a subscriber, right?

SPEAKER_02 8:48

I mean, I came to the trade show, and it gives you a chance to build value. Our relationship's a great example of that. Uh, whenever we end up getting together or whenever we're doing stuff like this, 90% of what we actually end up talking about is tangential to your core business or my core business. That's right. And that's how a relationship gets built. And once there's actual trust involved, then things like uh negotiating rates or whatever get a whole lot simpler. And if you spend the time getting so that the two people know each other and trust each other, as opposed to what's it gonna take for me to get into this ad today, it's a whole different world.

SPEAKER_01 9:37

So 100%, 100%, and I can tell you from my perspective, the the industry itself is going through this like monumental transitional moment, right? We're seeing things like AI and and digital advertising and things kind of overtaking the industry, but there's still a very large segmented audience here of contractors, plain community folks that just want what they've always had, good old, reliable, informational all the time. That's what I like about when I get my copies of the magazines or when I go to the trade shows. Like these are certain things that are just not gonna go away. And I mean, what was it? You gave me the numbers, it's a hundred thousand subscriptions from 60,000 unique subscribers. Is that yeah? Am I getting that right?

SPEAKER_02 10:29

That's give or take. I mean, it goes up or down a little bit, but yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:32

But uh that's crazy.

SPEAKER_02 10:34

Yeah, well, that's crazy, it's awesome. It's awesome. No, it's it's good, and it gives us resources. Um, but back to the what you were saying about AI and digital platforms and things. One of the things that I think I notice it a lot in young people coming into the industry is that they don't focus on what they need to do, they focus on how they're doing it. Because, like, for for example, um, we've got digital versions of our magazines, and one of the things that we do that's a little bit different is we post the PDFs of all of our issues on it, but we also reformat every article in every magazine so that you can actually read it on your phone without going insane. But that doesn't, it's it changes the delivery meth method, but it doesn't change the product. And whether you're looking at whether you're looking at AI, whether you're looking at email, whether you're looking at websites, whether you're looking at whatever, essentially our editorial, our job is to tell a story. And whether it's that, whether it's a podcast, whether it's a webinar, whether it's whatever, um you're still telling the story. And if your story sucks, it doesn't matter if you've got the best way in the world of getting it across, it still sucks.

SPEAKER_00 11:51

Correct.

SPEAKER_02 11:52

So it's that that kind of goes back to people focusing on what they actually do.

SPEAKER_01 11:58

People are focused on process, not on their sales. I've noticed that a lot. You know, everybody says they have the best processes in the world, but they're not the people who sell the most buildings, which drives me nuts from a sales perspective, right? I think that's one of the the the huge things in this industry. The younger you are, the more likely it is that you have what you feel is the best process. But if you're not selling the most buildings, then is it really the best process, right? No, I see that all the time. I see that all the time.

SPEAKER_02 12:25

But okay, but it's like uh talking about trade shows. One of the one of the things that we do at our trade shows is we have educational programming. And one of the cool things about our educational programming, whether it's the the panel discussion we're having on barn dominiums or whatever, is all of our educational programming is free. One of the things that is uh frustration is people will go to the programming that they like, not the programming that they need. Like you're mentioning that people want to focus on the prod on the process rather than on the product. That's because they're excited about how many clicks, what's my engagement, what's this, what's that. And they're they're excited about building the funnel when what they should really be excited about is building their business. And we can run, if we ran two educational programs at the same time, if we had an hour-long seminar at nine o'clock on uh preparing your business uh to sell and managing managing debt receivables and everything else to optimize the multiplier value for your business. And we ran one on the 10 best ways to drive a nail. Yeah, there'll be a hundred people watching somebody teach them how to do something that they've been doing for the last 40 years that they can probably do better than the person teaching the seminar. And there'll be three wives with their kids sitting in the back of the one about planning for succession and how to value your business.

SPEAKER_01 14:09

Yeah, yeah. I, man, it's funny that you say that because that is so true. The more you go to trade shows, the more that people tend to go to the things that they don't need to go to. Like you're there to learn something, right? And if there's a seminar that's offered, get outside your comfort zone. Again, Post Frame Rural Plane Builder Show, York, Pennsylvania, June 10th and the 11th. I can tell you right now, you want to be there. If you're listening to this, number one, you've got to be there. If you're in the area, come and hang out with us. We're all gonna be there. There are so many cool things that you're gonna be able to see and learn while you're there. I can tell you this much, and I just want to give shout-outs along the way. ASCO, Gray Repost, e Impact Marketing, uh McElroy Metal, uh, Red Dot Products. We love the we love the team at WEH Supply. There are so many things, whether you're needing supplies for your buildings, whether you're needing marketing help, whether you're needing just information in general, they're gonna be there. All right. Why not make the one stop you make in the summertime be a trip to York? It's beautiful this time of the year. And I can tell you, you will enjoy spending time. My Gary and I will be there. So if you're listening to us right now, where better than to come see us in York, right, Gary?

SPEAKER_02 15:28

There you go. We'll be there. Um, a couple, a couple of things, not that it still amazes me that anybody wants to talk to me, but that's a different conversation. Um, one of the differences that we do with our shows, our shows are smaller. We don't try to cram 20,000 exhibitors, I mean attendees on the floor. What that means is we can the the elevator pitch that I give to exhibitors is we cater to the people that sign the front of the check, not the back of the check. So we're looking at the people that are actually the business owners. What that really means is from the attendee side, is it means you're not going to have a whole lot of tourists, or at least not as many tourists. So if you want to talk to uh Thomas at ASC Machine Tools about a profile on a roll former, you'll actually have an opportunity to talk to Thomas and have a conversation, as opposed to standing in line between behind 17 other people, their kids, their dog, and the guy that sweeps up the bathrooms at night. So it's something where it's a little bit more of an exclusive clientele because the people that actually are the decision makers and are active in the business need that time to have conversations. Most trade shows, the objective is you go in, you get a contact name, you get out, and you follow up the week after the show because you don't have any opportunity to actually talk to them there. Ours aren't like that, and we don't want them to be like that.

SPEAKER_01 17:06

I have to give a little bit of a nugget, and Gary, I don't even know if you know this or not, but the whole reason that I do podcasting, the only reason that I do podcasting is I met Shannon at one of your shows, and we had a high-level conversation at a shield wall show, and I have said it every time since. There are two types of trade shows, and I love the way you describe it as the team that signs the front, not the back of the check, right? That could not be any more true. If you want one-to-one contact with a big company like a Graeber Post or an Accuform or you want to come talk to me, I'll be there. If you've been listening to me for the last couple of years on podcasts and you want some time with me or the team at Idea Room or Smart Build, I mean, there are so many good teammates here in the industry. You're not gonna find a better opportunity to get in front of them and spend some time with them. What I like about it is if you have a relationship with someone you can get in for free. You know, it this isn't necessarily that's the question I get asked a lot. The money that Gary gets from the door, the general admission goes to charity.

SPEAKER_02 18:23

Yeah, we donate all. I was gonna say, and it's only 50 bucks. There's no other place. I mean, for had somebody one time complain to me about having to pay 50 bucks to get in. And I kind of tend to be snarky on occasion. And I told him that if he can't afford to buy somebody lunch, he shouldn't be at the trade show. Um, but we we do donate it to charity. We've donated it, uh, we did a lot with relief for Hurricane Helene last year, uh, whenever the the Hawaii wildflow fires the year before that, we did stuff with Team Rubicon that is a group of veterans that goes in whenever everything's still hot and tries to fix things and save people. Um, we've done some things within the industry for people that had medical problems and emergencies, but all the money from the gates, if you give me 50 bucks at the show, that 50 bucks goes to somebody else. We don't keep that.

SPEAKER_01 19:19

Contact, contact your exhibitor of choice because they do have passes available as well. So if there is an exhibitor that you're coming to see or have a relationship with, contact them.

SPEAKER_02 19:32

You can find that on our website if you go to uh postframe builder show.com. That'll link to the tab on the frame building news site that will have all the exhibitors and all of our exhibit, all of our exhibitors get unlimited guest passes, and the guest passes are not limited, it's not something where you have to be the correct flavor of person, they can give them to anybody, and it's all also full full access passes. So it's not something where if you get a guest pass, we're gonna hit you up for more money to do the educational programming. Um, I just as a business practice, I don't believe in nickel and diamond people. I think that if you're gonna pay something, you ought to know what you're paying and what you're getting for it.

SPEAKER_01 20:14

What I really like. So, this is a call out to exhibitors. If you haven't done a shield wall show before, really wanna really want to stress what Gary just said there. So, as someone who's an exhibitor, right, I can give unlimited passes to clients, people that I want to come to the trade show to see my products in person. If there's, you know, York is a fairly centralized location for several different states, it's not that far off the beaten path. I can tell you, if you're in the market to exhibit your products at, you know, a trade show, I would give the team at Shieldwall a call. This is kind of your call to action. If you're anywhere near the role forming space, if you're a metal building manufacturer, roll forming, roll forming shows a really good place to be. There's a lot of people there that are looking for roll forming and roll forming equipment. That show's coming up later in the year, too. That one's gonna be in Gatlinburg, which is probably gonna be a blast.

SPEAKER_02 21:08

I'm sure you guys have lots of fun in Gatlinburg, and it's gonna be it's gonna be our biggest roll forming show. We're already, um, as far as booth sales go for that, we're already past where we were last year, and it's in September. So we'll probably add another one.

SPEAKER_00 21:21

That's gonna be an awesome time. That's gonna be an awesome time.

SPEAKER_02 21:24

Something else, too, just kind of a thumbnail for exhibitors. We are different than any other show that you're ever gonna do, and we do a couple of things. One of them is is all the exhibitors get the attendee list at no charge after the show. We don't sell it, we don't give it out. If you get any emails saying buy the exhibitor list, it's from a shield wall show, it's a scam. We don't sell our lists, but we do give it away to exhibitors after the show. We also don't nickel and dime you for things. Like if you go to most shows, you get to pay about $800. Bucks for a scanner for the QR codes on so you can yeah, tell me about that one. We we actually made the and that this was uh Gary being uh an I'll difficult customer, we'll say I would have probably phrased that a little more crudely if this wasn't being a podcast. Um, but we actually made I actually badgered the people that do the software for that we use for attendees into changing their QR codes so that all of the information for the contact is embedded in the QR code. Uh normally what happens is you you pay 800 bucks for a scanner, and then that links to a proprietary software program that if you try to scan it off of your phone or anything else, the there will be virtually no useful information in the QR codes on the people's badges. So all the stuff with the badges is a scam to get you to buy an $800 scammer for two days. Um, ours, all of the all of the contact information, name, address, phone number, email, everything is in that QR code. So you can actually just scan it with that, use a free program and put it into an Excel sheet, or you can use it and scan it and directly put it into an Outlook contact. And this is and if you feel guilty and you'd like to give me 800 bucks for that, you're welcome to just give it to me in cash at the show.

SPEAKER_01 23:24

This is this is a key component for not just exhibitors, but also for attendees. So if you meet somebody at the show that you want to form a relationship with, it's a quick way to scan a badge and be on your way. And let me just give you a nickel's worth of free advice. You don't even need anything fancy, it's just the camera on most smartphones these days will pull up a QR code and you can get that scanned. And I can tell you, that's a huge benefit, man. Gary, that's a huge benefit.

SPEAKER_02 23:52

Well, and it's for a long time I was involved kind of in the back end on other shows, and one of the things that I got to see is I got to see all the frustrations of the things that other people did, and I was working on something and I got a critter to get rid of, is one of the things that I was told was an advantage is I don't have to, whenever I see something I want to fix, since I own the company, I fix it. I don't need to go through a committee, I don't need anybody else's approval, I don't need to stand on one leg, spin a plate, and do all kind of stupid tricks. So, what that means is there's a lot of things like that that we just don't need to deal with. I mean, like one of the big problems at a lot of trade shows is what people a problem for exhibitors is what people call brown bagging. And that's there'll be somebody that is a manufacturer that's walking the show floor and basically jumping on people after they come out of one of their competitors' booths and trying to steal them as a customer. And we actually not only try to prevent that, anybody at my shows that turns at turns over somebody to me that's brown bagging on the floor, I'll give a $50 reward. And then I kick them out of the show. We've got a number of people, and and it's a running joke. Ask Messi the stories about that. Um, I've got some people that think it's funny because I will literally chase down people down the aisles whenever they're doing that, but it's not fair to the exhibitors, and it also creates a bad experience for the attendees because basically people are getting stalked in the aisle by people that they don't necessarily want to talk to or have any idea who they are.

SPEAKER_01 25:39

But well, this is your this is your show from really from concept to reality, yeah, and you take immense responsibility in making sure that not just the exhibitors, the attendees, anyone that's there inside of that environment is taken care of and honored, whether it be their exhibitor fees that are paid or their attendee fees that are paid or whatever, you want them to get the best experience possible and you take that feedback very seriously. What I can tell you about other trade shows that I've been to is they're managed by marketing companies, they're managed by people who don't necessarily have the end user in mind. They're trying to take care of a bigger project for a client, whereas Shield Wall handles the Shield Wall team takes care of all the planning for this event. So it's curated from the top down, and everything about it is made for the industry. It's by people who know the industry inside and out and been doing this a lifetime. I mean, however many hundreds of years of experience your team has combined, you know, that's the team experience that's brought to a shield wall show. That's why it feels good. You know, one of the main things that people go on and on about is the is the uh the buffet, right? You guys have some feed people pretty well. Man, you guys feed us. I can tell you right now. That's I mean, that's the highlight, man. After you've closed a couple of deals on the sales floor, after you've enjoyed a you know, a couple of days of really just getting into it, man. The food. No, that's I know that's funny.

SPEAKER_02 27:11

Honestly, the food would probably cost you more than the $50 entry fee. Because we've got we've got an open bar too. And one of the things long time ago, I had a sales guy, uh, whenever I was just a little puppy, tell me that if you sell somebody something, you can sell them garbage, but if you give them something, you gotta give them something good. So, like we've got we've got like uh top shelf shelf things to drink, we've got good quality food, and and yeah, we're not being facetious either.

SPEAKER_01 27:42

I'm serious. If you're in the area, it's worth coming just for that. Like, seriously, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 27:48

If you if you showed up at Wednesday on 4 30, whenever that opens, there'll be entertainment. If you pay the 50 bucks, it's a cheap date.

SPEAKER_01 27:56

Yeah, yeah, it's a it's a great cheap date. I can tell you, you guys had these sliders in Dayton at the roll forming show last year, these like little cheeseburger sliders. Man, those were so good. And I can tell you, after you've after you've been on the show floor all day, it's a great way to end your day. Meet with a couple of clients, or if you're a customer, look for your favorite vendor. That's the time to close that deal. That that's right. Well, and that's it's it's a social appearance.

SPEAKER_02 28:22

That's the way business really happens, yeah. You know, I mean, business one of the funniest things is watching people that don't understand an elevator pitch trying to come up with an elevator pitch. Because so, how much business do you come across that you run into somebody where you're both on the escalator, you're going into the bathroom, or you're in line getting those sliders or whatever, and you've got 15 seconds to get somebody's attention and tell them why you know, Jared, I recognize you. This is why, and boom, hit them. That's that's basically where the our shows get the people that sign the front of the check, not the back of the check, came from.

SPEAKER_01 29:08

Yeah, because I can tell you that's exactly the way it is. That that is really that is probably the best way to sum it up. Is you are going to generate better relationships at a show like this because it's curated from the top down.

SPEAKER_02 29:23

Well, well, it's the real reason for that is, and anybody that knows me, there's not a whole lot of things that I do that I don't have a reason that I can explain for. It's just kind of the way my brain works. Sometimes it's a good thing, sometimes not. Um, but whenever the bigger shows have to serve two masters. The bigger shows are tied to an association. A part of the objective for that association is educating the rank and file. Educating the rank and file means doing things like safety training for the people that are going to be on the roof, safety training for the guy that's carrying the hammer, safety training for the guy that's gonna be driving the truck. And that's how you drive big numbers of people on the floor as well. So it is in their best interest to do things like uh, and we partner with them on a lot of things. Like we started partnering with the NFBA on a lot of things, and one of the big things they have every year is they have uh nail uh maze sponsors and maze nails sponsors and nail driving competition. And I can tell you that I will, and nothing against that, and we love the guys that swing hammers, but I'll bet that there's not one CEO or one person that's actually signs a check or has sole decision-making authority that was putting on goggles and banging on a banging on a nail with a stiletto hammer.

SPEAKER_01 30:48

Yeah, I I I don't like being pulled away from the trade show floor. A lot of other trade shows really focus on not keeping the trade show floor open for large periods of time. They really focus on these like three and four hour blocks. And, you know, hey, to each their own, but if you're spending the kind of money that you're spending to exhibit your product, I want front and center, as much time as possible, open space with the customers, the sales floor people. I want it open. That's what I value about it. I mean as a as an exhibitor and somebody who's been there as a customer and somebody who's been there as an exhibitor, I can tell you that's the best part about it, right? If you've got multiple team members, you're gonna have time to get that other team member out there to walk the floor and maybe talk to other businesses, right? That's a thing that I really enjoyed about the role forming show. That specific task of when I was there with my partner, I was out working the floor, I was talking to people, then we'd switch, you know, and there was just lots of time to interact. And it gives the customer so much more time to interact with you and your products and not be in such a tight window. That's a big part of it. I mean, that's a huge advantage, in my opinion. I was disappointed, quite frankly, with that last trade show we went to a little bit because I didn't have the time and attention that I really wanted to have with the customers. I had to schedule time off site, and not that that's a bad thing, but you know, if it's 7:30 and I've been standing most of the day, I might want to just go get something to eat with my team or go back to the hotel room and chill. But it were forced me to work outside the confines of the sales floor, which is somewhat uncomfortable a little bit, I think.

SPEAKER_02 32:38

Well, some of that has to do with the mechanics of the way that the show's done and their value proposition, though. Because if you come to our shows and you get through the door either for free if you're a guest of an exhibitor, or for 50 bucks, there's a different value that needs to be associated to be worthwhile than if you're paying somebody 350, 400 bucks to do education to see the educational programming. If you're paying if you're paying 400 bucks to include classes, you're gonna prioritize the classes. If you're paying 50 bucks to get on the exhibit floor, you're gonna prioritize getting on the exhibit floor. Um, I mean, if you if you paid a whole bunch to be able to attend classes, and you were so busy talking to exhibitors that you didn't attend any classes, you'd feel like a chump.

SPEAKER_00 33:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 33:36

So for sure.

SPEAKER_00 33:38

For sure.

SPEAKER_02 33:38

It's a part of it's a structural thing, and that's but that that's one of the things that we do. I mean, one of the reasons everything that we do, whether it's our magazines, whether it's our shows, whether it's these, we do different, we do things a little bit different for a reason. Because if we did everything exactly the same as everybody else does, you'd have no reason to choose us over the other people.

SPEAKER_01 34:03

And I think it sets you guys apart, right? It makes you more contractor focused, in my opinion. I mean, you're focused on your core clients, you're for you're focused on the people that are coming to your trade shows and giving them the most enjoyable experience possible. That's why I love going.

SPEAKER_02 34:21

Well, and and we're focused on trying to benefit the industry. Um, because like the uh to two two things. I mean, one of them, we'll do this again. Um, but we give these away. These are free. We're gonna start selling them to people outside the industry probably this fall. But so far, since October, uh, we've given away, and we're into the second printing, we've given away 5,000 max builds of metal roofs. They go to schools, they go to individuals, they go to libraries, uh, they go to associations, and it's to get give little kids uh positive exposure to the construction trades while they're making emotional attachments before they're six years old. So that then instead of being an I want to be an astronaut, I want to be a baseball player, I want to be a whatever, god forbidden.

SPEAKER_01 35:13

YouTube influencer, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 35:18

But we kind of we went through the same bad joke at the same time. That's awesome.

SPEAKER_01 35:22

Um it's not a joke, though. It's not a joke. Get your kids off YouTube. It should be. It should be a joke, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 35:34

But it's too bad it's not. No, it is. Well, it'll it'll cycle back through. And the world need the world needs people making fries and burgers, too. So the influencers will end up rotating through.

SPEAKER_01 35:50

Everything matters. We need people to do things, okay. AI is not gonna build your building, okay. If you're listening alongside this, let me get on my pedestal for 30 seconds. AI will never build a house, okay? It's just not gonna do it. We're still gonna need tradesmen, we're still gonna need people that are swinging hammers and driving nails. That's never gonna be an AI process. I don't care. We are a lifetime away from that, so that's why I want to talk specifically to you, Mr. Contractor, you, Mr. Building Dealer, you, Mr. whatever it is you're doing. The swinging of hammer and driving of nails and and getting that emphasis in kids. Like I've got three daughters, I want them to know trades. Quite frankly, they might make more going into trades than going into a you know what would be considered a elite profession, right? I wouldn't mind if if if my daughter swung a hammer, drove a nail, worked on a car. Um, to me, it builds character and teaches valuable lessons and life skills by getting and working with your hands. And what I love about Gary, and Gary won't give himself enough credit, is that Gary really, really cares about that. Gary has passions beyond a trade show, passions beyond a magazine. And Gary will tell you all about Max builds a metal roof and Max builds a pole barn, because that's when Gary gets real, real high-level caring about it. Am I right about that, Gary?

SPEAKER_02 37:16

Yeah, well, it's it's a chance to do something good. It's a chance to do something good. And just back, you know, it's yes, yes. If making money is fine, and gosh knows I'm not gonna complain about getting paid marginally more than minimum wage, but it doesn't change anything. If somebody said if somebody says, and I'm old, I mean, and I'm luckily still getting older. Um, but whenever anybody talks about their legacy, anybody that says I made this much money is a loser.

SPEAKER_00 37:55

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 37:56

People that aren't people that aren't losers get to say, I created things, I did this, I had this impact, I helped these people. And if that's not what you get excited about, you're doing the wrong freaking thing. 100%. And back to what you were saying about AI, that kind of circles back to a conversation that we had earlier. AI isn't a product, AI is a delivery mechanism. If you understand what your product is, you can use AI as a tool. AI is never going to be a substitute for the actual product. Uh, good example is I some of our competitors that will remain nameless are now generating their editorial content with AI. They actually fired their editorial staffs. If my editors weren't bringing value, I would fire them too. But AI doesn't have relationships with people. AI can't talk to people that are out in the field and say, hey Jared, we're looking to try to figure out what's next in metal buildings. What are you seeing on a daily basis? If you've got one secret that you need to share with the industry, what should we be writing about? What what concerns are hitting you right now? My editors can do that, and my editors are good at good at that. ChatGP doesn't. Chat DP, everything with everything with any of the large language model AI stuff is by definition in the past. If it wasn't in the past, they couldn't search it. Anyone that's in business that's more that's worried more about what they did last year than what they knew next year is gonna be unemployed by the end of the summer. So and whether it's editors or whether it's anything else, if if you can be replaced by a tool, you shouldn't be employed in the first place. And I'll be the first person to I'm gonna rephrase that. I will I was gonna be I was gonna be normal me instead of podcast polite me. But if you can't if you can't bring value beyond what AI does, you don't deserve a paycheck.

SPEAKER_01 40:16

True story. It will thin the herds. AI is a tool that will thin the herds for sure. It's gonna bring the people who are actually performing to the top of the fields. I use AI. I mean, I'm not gonna, I I I can't sit back and say I utilize it to streamline myself, I use it as an organization. I mean, I can tell you from an organized side of my life, I've never been more organized than I am right now. Gary and I were talking about this before we got on the on the podcast together. We both stay super busy, we both got our hands all over the place, but I can tell you, I'm better off for using it. But that doesn't mean that it's gonna replace me because nobody's gonna replace me. Nobody's gonna replace Gary, right? You know, relationships are everything. And I will I will say this as we close out because we're right at our we're right at our time. We're gonna get Gary back. Okay, Gary's gonna be on as a as a contributor periodically. We've got so much stuff to do with Shield Wall in the future, but right now, if you're listening and you've made it through the episode, get to the post-frame rural plane builder show in York. You can see us do this live. We'll talk in person. If there's an interest for that, we'll get Gary over to the booth. We're gonna be out in front. As you come in, you're gonna see America Builds Better. Gary is giving us a huge opportunity to be there and be part of this trade show. And honestly, I just love the opportunity, but I love going. And I can't wait for you to be there with me. If you decide to come, great. Reach out to me, Jared at AmericaBuildsbetter.com. If you need an exhibitor ticket, I'll get you in. How's that? We'll make sure that you get in and get to hang out with us for a little while because we just want you to come and experience it with us. This is going to be a very, very fun time. Gary, you got anything for us as we're finishing out, brother?

SPEAKER_02 42:04

Just come to the show. And if there's anything that Shieldwall Media that we can do that we do well, that we do better. I am unfortunately silly enough that my cell phone number and email are actually in pretty much all of our magazines. So if it's a true story, yeah, no, it is. I'll get I'll get I'll be driving down the road and my cell phone will go off, and it'll be somebody that wants to cancel their subscription because their husband died. And the number of times is like, wait, the guy that owns this is answering the phone. What the but if you need me, if you need me for anything, have suggestions, uh, want us to send you some of the Max books, whatever. Um, you can find me. That's one of the reasons that we try, that's one of the reasons that we can do what we do.

SPEAKER_01 42:52

Yep. Gary and his team at Shieldwall Media are always making post frame better moving forward. And I can tell you, if you're in the need for any of the pay uh any of the trade publications, plain builder, rural builder, role forming magazine, frame building news, etc. etc., ShieldWallmedia.com is where you want to go. There's a subscribe button at the top of the page. Click subscribe, fill out your information, pick which one of the magazines, maybe all of them, get them coming. They're free. Okay. June 10th and the 11th in York will be there for the rural post-frame plane builder show sponsored by Frame Building News. Thank you, as always, to the team from Idea Room and Defined SEO. They are helping us move forward and build better. Get out in your communities and do something good for somebody else. I promise you, I swear to you, it will make you feel better. It always makes me feel better. We'll be back at you next week with episode two of this series. We're going to talk to someone special. So we'll be here. We want to see you here with us. Have a great week, and we'll talk to y'all soon. Thank you for checking out America Builds Better. If that episode fired you up, make sure you hit subscribe, leave a review, and share this with someone who's ready to level up. We are dropping powerful content filled with strategies, stories, and real talk from the builders shaping the industry. Stay hungry, stay focused, and keep building better. Make sure to check us out at AmericaBuildsbetter.com for more resources and industry tools. This is America Builds Better, where the industry talks back.